For example, 'It seems that fulfilling the value of altruism helps them feel their lives are meaningful.'
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2The very simple answer is "No". The sentence is simply badly-written.– FattieCommented Oct 26, 2018 at 8:45
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1values cannot be fulfilled: goals, aims, objectives, targets etc.– LambieCommented Oct 26, 2018 at 22:48
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1Abstract concepts cannot be fulfilled. But they can be brought to fruition (realized).– MazuraCommented Oct 27, 2018 at 2:24
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@Mazura "But they can be brought to fruition (realized)". I've already mentioned one of the definitions dictionaries give for fulfil is some variant of "to realise", "make real", "convert into reality", "bring into realisation".– ZebrafishCommented Oct 27, 2018 at 9:05
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Also, I've included a few quotations of "fulfil(l) the values". I understand most of you consider it to be incorrect. Still, I've added them just for fun.– ZebrafishCommented Oct 27, 2018 at 15:18
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3 Answers
Yes and no. No - because a value is an idea, a concept. Yes - because we are fulfilling something that matches this value.
For example, I think my watch has a value of 20 dollars. However, it can never be 20 dollars because a watch is a watch and I can only exchange it for 20 dollars.
However, by exchanging the watch for money, I fulfill my idea that the value of the watch is 20 dollars.
Language is language, and to explain all that each time is time consuming, so we say that we 'fulfill a value'.
answered Oct 26, 2018 at 7:09
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The third paragraph here is completely wrong. You would not be "fulfilling" your "idea" in question. You're possibly thinking of "confirming an idea", or something else? Fulfill (look in a dictionary) means "complete" or "finish" or "wrap-up".– FattieCommented Oct 26, 2018 at 8:53
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1@Fattie Again, you're imposing your own narrow definition of fulfil: "1. To bring into actuality; effect or make real:" / "to carry out, or bring to realization, as a prophecy or promise. " / "Achieve or realize (something desired, promised, or predicted) Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 9:26
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2Trevor, I'm going to upvote your answer because I feel that the downvote was completely unfair based on the reasoning given, namely that an idea can't be fulfilled. Browsing a number of dictionaries one can easily see that this is not the case. This user seems to have come along and with their narrow understanding of word meanings and has decided to impose their own meaning of English and downvoted both our answers. I find the first statement of their own answer completely absurd, but given that my habit is that I don't downvote, I didn't. Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 10:10
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2@Fattie - so a dream can and an idea cannot? So dreams are never ideas, as in 'I have a dream of owning a shed'? Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 10:53
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1@Fattie Again you're ignoring the dictionary definitions of to realise, effect, actualise and make real. Nothing to do with completion necessarily. A value, which is an abstract concept, can be realised. I'm not going to quote them again I believe I've done so about 3 times. Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 11:03
Wowie, what a train wreck this has been so far. He said, she said. People quoting conflicting dictionary definitions at each other and whatnot. Thinking up convoluted arguments and getting all agitated at one another.
Well then. Let them have their fun. Meanwhile the rest of us, how about we'll just have a quick look at the reality of the language.
Here is the complete list of things that humanity has managed to fulfill so far according to the actual usage stats from the British National Corpus (BNC):
RESPONSIBILITIES 3
REQUIREMENTS 3
PROMISES 3
ROLE 3
PROMISE 2
FUNCTION 2
COMMITMENTS 2
ROLES 2
CONDITIONS 2
WISH 1
WILL 1
TASK 1
PURPOSES 1
DREAMS 1
DEMANDS 1
DEMAND 1
CRITERIA 1
POSITION 1
PLAN 1
OBLIGATIONS 1
NEED 1
IDEA 1
And here is an even more generous list of the top 200 nouns that ever follow fulfill in the entire Corpus of Contemporary American English (COCA):
PROMISE 209
DREAM 124
MISSION 112
OBLIGATIONS 104
NEEDS 95
ROLE 89
PROMISES 85
REQUIREMENTS 77
DUTIES 74
DREAMS 64
EXPECTATIONS 63
POTENTIAL 63
OBLIGATION 62
RESPONSIBILITIES 61
ROLES 50
NEED 45
DESTINY 45
COMMITMENTS 45
RESPONSIBILITY 44
DUTY 38
COMMITMENT 35
FUNCTION 32
GOALS 32
PURPOSE 32
MANDATE 31
DESIRES 27
REQUIREMENT 27
OBJECTIVES 27
VISION 27
GOAL 26
FUNCTIONS 25
CONTRACT 25
PART 23
DEMANDS 22
CONDITIONS 21
PROPHECY 21
PURPOSES 19
DESIRE 18
LIFE 17
AMBITIONS 15
WISHES 15
PLEDGE 15
TASK 14
REQUEST 14
OBJECTIVE 13
CRITERIA 13
HOPES 13
FANTASIES 12
MISSIONS 12
TASKS 12
TERMS 11
ORDERS 11
REQUESTS 11
FANTASY 11
COURSE 11
ASPIRATIONS 11
CONTRACTS 10
FATHER 10
OATH 10
WISH 10
VOW 10
STATE 9
PRESIDENT 9
DEMAND 9
AMBITION 9
LAW 8
LEADERSHIP 8
PLEDGES 8
ORDER 8
MOTHER 7
AGENDA 7
COMMUNITY 7
CHILDHOOD 7
AGREEMENT 6
ASSIGNMENT 6
INFORMATION 6
FAMILY 6
PROPHECIES 6
QUOTAS 6
TEACHING 6
SIDE 6
WILL 6
TRUST 6
SECURITY 5
RIGHTS 5
PLANS 5
PRODUCTION 5
PROFESSION 5
NUMBER 5
EXPECTATION 5
END 5
IDEALS 5
GRADUATION 5
LONGING 5
CHARGE 5
COMMANDMENT 5
COMMISSIONS 5
DEFINITION 5
CONDITION 5
CALLING 4
CHARTER 4
CAREER 4
AGENCY 4
AGREEMENTS 4
MANDATES 4
LIVES 4
LEGACY 4
HEART 4
HOPE 4
DESTINIES 4
EDUCATION 4
PARTY 4
PEOPLE 4
READER 4
PUBLIC 4
PLAN 4
SCHOOL 4
SCRIPTURE 4
SENSE 4
VOWS 4
VOCATION 4
VISIONS 3
WHIMS 3
RIGHT 3
TREATY 3
WORK 3
SCIENCE 3
TEACHER 3
SPONSOR 3
STANDARD 3
STANDARDS 3
STUDENT 3
STUDENTS 3
RANGE 3
PARENTS 3
MANAGEMENT 3
MR 3
ELECTION 3
ENERGY 3
GENDER 3
IDEAL 3
HEALTH 3
GUIDELINES 3
INTENTION 3
JOB 3
BUSINESS 3
CHILD 3
COMPANY 3
COMMISSION 3
COMMANDS 3
CHILDREN 3
CHURCH 3
CORE 3
CRITERION 3
DAY 3
DEGREE 3
CRIME 3
DEAL 3
DESIGN 2
DEATHBED 2
DEBT 2
CUSTOMER 2
CONSUMER 2
CITIZENSHIP 2
CITY 2
CLASS 2
CHOICE 2
COMMANDMENTS 2
CLIENT 2
COLLEGE 2
COMMAND 2
CHARACTERISTICS 2
BULK 2
ASSESSMENT 2
BODY 2
AIM 2
AIMS 2
ACHIEVEMENT 2
JUDGMENT 2
INTENTIONS 2
INTEREST 2
INTERESTS 2
KIND 2
INTENT 2
LICENSE 2
LOAN 2
LOT 2
HISTORY 2
HUMANITY 2
IMAGE 2
IMPERATIVE 2
INDIVIDUAL 2
INJUNCTION 2
GALA 2
GOVERNANCE 2
GOVERNMENT 2
FUNCTIONALITY 2
EXECUTIVE 2
POWERS 1
Note that this list includes not just direct objects of the verb fulfill, but just any nouns that follow it, i.e. also noun modifiers of its actual objects. You can't really fulfill a mister or a deathbed or a college or a mother. But you can fulfill Mr Smith's requirements, or a deathbed wish, or a college's needs, or your mother's dream. That's how all these weird hits end up on the list. I was thinking about cleaning these up, and might still do that as time permits, but in the mean time they actually help drive home the following point:
The word "value" is nowhere to be seen.
So not only has nobody ever fulfilled a value. Nobody has ever so much as fulfilled a value requirement or a value goal or a value need or a value anything.
In conclusion, what you have is not English as she is spoke or wrote. You can't use it. If you did, you might actually be the very first person, on either side of the pond, to have ever done so.
answered Oct 26, 2018 at 22:45
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This fulfills every requirement of a data-based answer. Surely this can all just be migrated to English Language Learners now?– FattieCommented Oct 27, 2018 at 3:26
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The corpora results are goods, but the conclusion is just wrong. Some words that are synonyms of the ones in the list don't appear: "target", "endeavour", "undertaking", "chore", "office", "pursuit", "scheme", "guarantee", "assurance". I find it worrying to hear you imply that because a word doesn't appear in that list that nobody's ever fulfilled [that word]. That would mean nobody's ever fulfilled a "target" or "undertaking". I don't want to insist that "fulfil a value" is acceptable, I've looked through different meanings and challenged my views, I'm taking a logical approach. Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 8:53
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@Zebrafish it's not me implying that, it's all speakers of the language collectively saying it to our faces. If the OP asks if they can shave a car, we look through the corpora, and there are no hits, then we can, and must, say "that's not what people actually do, you just might be the first person ever." You are free to shave your car, and fulfill your value, and lick your mathematics. The question here is not whether you can do as you please, the question is whether others are just as pleased to do it. And they are not. If that worries you, excellent. Because it should. Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 11:29
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People approaching this logically is precisely the issue. I say as much in the opening paragraph. If we approach things logically, then "I'm on the bus" is not English. It must be "I'm in the bus". And nobody can possibly say "my father lived in London when he was five", because when he was five, he wasn't their father. No father in the world entire was ever five. And people just don't ride on buses. That's what logic gives you. But this question is not about logic, it's about language. And so it's the language that we must be looking at. Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 11:39
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If the question were "can I fulfill a requirement", nobody here would so much as open a dictionary. Everybody would just say "sure mate, I hear it all the time". That would be our answer in its entirety. The very fact that people feel compelled to appeal to logic and construct argument chains and go hunting for loopholes in definitions is a dead giveaway that something's not right. And the fact that other people still object after all that work is done, is all the answer the OP needs. Their question is, would people object to what I have. Well yes, they would. Here are some that do. Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 12:19
fulfil
1. To bring into actuality; effect or make real: fulfilled their promises; fulfilled her dream.
American Heritage Dictionary2a : to put into effect : execute
3a : to convert into reality
Merriam-Webster Dictionary
Altruism can mean can describe an act done for another selflessly. Helping an old lady cross the road can be considered altruism. Or it can be an idea, philosophy, tendency, or even a value. I doubt anyone thinks that "altruistic values" is nonsensical or a strange term. As the definition above says, to fulfil can mean to bring to actuality, meaning to bring to reality. So I don't see why altruism as a value can't be fulfilled. Though most of the time this meaning of value is seen in the plural, "values".
altruism
1. the principle or practice of unselfish concern for the welfare of others
Collins English Dictionary
Notice it says the "principle or practice", much like what I said, ie., the "act", or the "philosophy" or "inclination", or even belief and value.
'It seems that fulfilling the value of altruism helps them feel their lives are meaningful.'
Edit: Please note, many users have expressed their disapproval of "value" being an object of "fulfil". I somewhat understand why they feel this way. The argument seems to be that the verb fulfil means to complete or finish, and therefore things such as plans and goals can be fulfilled, but not values and ideas, and that saying such a thing makes no sense. More recently an argument has been made based on English corpora results. However I feel it's acceptable, and I've given the relevant definitions to explain why I think it's fine. However note that it is in fact very unidiomatic, as the results I've seen show. I'm also tempted to delete this answer entirely as I seem to be in the minority, and will probably get downvoted. I've given two alternatives at the end you may want to consider.
I would say that altruistic acts do make a person feel better, but the point you make about altruism bringing meaning to people's lives in my opinion seems to detract from the true meaning of altruism because true altruism most accurately means doing something without consideration for oneself, that is, it's motivated for concern for others.
Having said that, you may consider using other terms:
- putting into action one's values of altruism
- actualising one's values of altruism.
Just for fun, here are a couple of examples I found (note I'm not advocating its use, most users here seem to consider this usage incorrect)
The H2OK program aims to increase awareness that reducing organic matter entering storm drains can improve local water quality, giving residents a way to fulfill the values they hold about protecting water quality.
Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America journal article, 2018Resolved: a parliamentary system of government would better fulfill the values underlying the American Constitution.
1987 National Speech & Debate Tournament debate topicThus, the issue for rights theorists adopting the dignity and autonomy perspective... is whether the law offers employees enough job security in order to fulfil the values they are advocating.
Perspectives on Labour Law, Cambridge University Press, 2004...Ireland should be part of that initiative not just out of pragmatism but also to fulfil the values associated with EU membership.
The Irish Times opinion piece, January 2018The commitments described in this Privacy Policy fulfil the values, the principles of action and behaviour of CDL and are established...
Caudan Arts Centre Privacy Policy
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1This answer is basically completely wrong from top to bottom. For example, the first sentence "Altruism can mean an act done for another selflessly" is totally incorrect. The act is not altruism. You're completely confusing adjectives with nouns to begin with. Say I helped a granny, you could not say "That was a nice altruism." The sentence as stated ... ie the sentence in the question ... is quite simply totally incorrect. "fulfilling the value of altruism" is a nonsensical phrase.– FattieCommented Oct 26, 2018 at 8:47
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1@Fattie So you disagree with the definition of Collins Dictionary on "altruism", and in addition also disagree to the the definition of "fulfil", " To bring into actuality; effect or make real". You're simply imposing your own narrow definitions, which is quite obnoxious. I never said to use "an altruism", don't use strawmen. I merely said what the definitions I quoted have said, that to fulfil is to realise, bring to reality or actuality, and that altruism can be the practice of altruism. So yes, ideas can be fulfilled (ie., realised, brought into action), as the dictionaries say. Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 9:20
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"Altruism can mean an act done for another selflessly" is incorrect. The act is not altruism. You can not say "That was a nice altruism." You could say "that was a nice act of altruism."– FattieCommented Oct 26, 2018 at 9:26
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@Fattie "The act is not altruism". It obviously is, as the act is the practice of altruism, as defined. Again, I did not advise to say "an altruism". Doing voluntary work is an act of altruism, is the practice of altruism, and yes, is altruism itself. A charity donation, which is an act of altruism, is altruism in itself. Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 9:31
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1@Fattie That's not true. Tossing a coin to a beggar is an act of altruism. Tossing a coin to a beggar is altruism because altruism, as I've quoted, can include "the practice" itself. So in this case the act of altruism is altruism. You mustn't have actually looked at the definitions I quoted. And your digression about voluntary work not being an act, that's wrong too. "I did voluntary work on the weekend" most likely means I did many different things, but it can be seen as one act of selfless voluntarism. This just further shows how restrictive you are with your definitions. Commented Oct 26, 2018 at 12:13