Timeline for Can one fulfil a value?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
14 events
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| Jun 22, 2022 at 8:16 | history | edited | CommunityBot |
replaced http://corpus.byu.edu with https://www.english-corpora.org
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| Oct 27, 2018 at 16:44 | comment | added | Lambie | Oh dear, I cannot believe I didn't know about that book. Shame on me. (especially with my fluency in Portuguese and French.) However, I know a more modern one: The Cow Went to the Swamp (A Vaca Foi Pro Brejo). So, I'm not a total loser. [:)] | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 16:35 | comment | added | RegDwigнt | @Lambie wait, "English as she is spoke" does not remind you of "English as she is spoke"? | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 15:27 | comment | added | Lambie | "English as she is spoke or wrote"? Sounds positively piratical and reminds me of a "stove boat". Logic is really not germane to these questions. Reasoning and rationality based on one's internalized corpora is. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 15:05 | comment | added | Zebrafish | No problem. By the way, just for fun I've included some quotes from books, articles, etc, from both BrE and AmE. I've pointed out that, from the looks of it, folk round these parts consider it incorrect. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 14:22 | comment | added | RegDwigнt | Well, I didn't go into this thinking "nonono, you can't shave a car". And I didn't go into it thinking "of course you can, duh". I figured, "gee, no idea". I read every answer and every comment. And I still had no idea. What do people do to their cars? So I went and asked the people. All of them. Ready to accept that everyone shaves cars all the time. But it just so turns out that they don't. You are still free to shave yours. And to fulfill all your targets and undertakings. And to ride in the bus. And to not be aware that other people don't actually do that. But I am aware now. Is all. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 13:33 | comment | added | Zebrafish | My issue with you saying that no one has ever fulfilled a value, that it's not English and that they can't use it is not the mere the fact that you said it, but that you did so based on those corpus results. I've shown this reasoning isn't satisfactory. This reasoning implies to fulfil a target or undertaking is not English and can't be used. Finally, I understand the question exactly as it's asked, "Can one fulfil a value?" I've answered that question strictly. How idiomatic it is or advisable to say is another matter I addressed in my answer, ie., I admit it's very uncommon and unidiomatic. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 13:32 | comment | added | Zebrafish | I feel you missed my point about approaching this logically. Applying logic doesn't mean concluding that "on the bus" means on the roof of the bus, as you said. That would be being excessively literal. It means applying one of the definitions of "on" and finding that it can indeed mean to be in a vehicle of transport. That's the sort of logic I mean to apply. One of the common definitions of "fulfil" is "to realise", "make real", "convert into reality", "bring into realisation", this is the meaning I test when considering if it can apply to a specific object. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 12:19 | comment | added | RegDwigнt | If the question were "can I fulfill a requirement", nobody here would so much as open a dictionary. Everybody would just say "sure mate, I hear it all the time". That would be our answer in its entirety. The very fact that people feel compelled to appeal to logic and construct argument chains and go hunting for loopholes in definitions is a dead giveaway that something's not right. And the fact that other people still object after all that work is done, is all the answer the OP needs. Their question is, would people object to what I have. Well yes, they would. Here are some that do. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 11:39 | comment | added | RegDwigнt | People approaching this logically is precisely the issue. I say as much in the opening paragraph. If we approach things logically, then "I'm on the bus" is not English. It must be "I'm in the bus". And nobody can possibly say "my father lived in London when he was five", because when he was five, he wasn't their father. No father in the world entire was ever five. And people just don't ride on buses. That's what logic gives you. But this question is not about logic, it's about language. And so it's the language that we must be looking at. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 11:29 | comment | added | RegDwigнt | @Zebrafish it's not me implying that, it's all speakers of the language collectively saying it to our faces. If the OP asks if they can shave a car, we look through the corpora, and there are no hits, then we can, and must, say "that's not what people actually do, you just might be the first person ever." You are free to shave your car, and fulfill your value, and lick your mathematics. The question here is not whether you can do as you please, the question is whether others are just as pleased to do it. And they are not. If that worries you, excellent. Because it should. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 8:53 | comment | added | Zebrafish | The corpora results are goods, but the conclusion is just wrong. Some words that are synonyms of the ones in the list don't appear: "target", "endeavour", "undertaking", "chore", "office", "pursuit", "scheme", "guarantee", "assurance". I find it worrying to hear you imply that because a word doesn't appear in that list that nobody's ever fulfilled [that word]. That would mean nobody's ever fulfilled a "target" or "undertaking". I don't want to insist that "fulfil a value" is acceptable, I've looked through different meanings and challenged my views, I'm taking a logical approach. | |
| Oct 27, 2018 at 3:26 | comment | added | Fattie | This fulfills every requirement of a data-based answer. Surely this can all just be migrated to English Language Learners now? | |
| Oct 26, 2018 at 22:45 | history | answered | RegDwigнt | CC BY-SA 4.0 |