Counting stops without ambiguity

Question

A typical conversation on a bus:

Alice: Have we reached our stop yet, Bob?

Bob: No, Alice. Two more stops to go.

Alice: Do you mean "two more stops, then ours" or "one more stop, then ours"?

I find it hard to express concisely and unambiguously how many more stops there are until we have to get off the bus. Any suggestions?

A few thoughts. Obviously, "next stop" is pretty clear. I find "next but one" unambiguous too, but then "next but seven" is getting a bit awkward. What if the bus is sitting at a stop while you speak - should that stop count or not? I wonder if one could find a way of counting the number of journey sections remaining, rather than the number of stops remaining.

Answer 1

The general principle is that you don't count the stop that you are at. From this, we can derive the following scenario.

You're at station A and want to get to station D. You don't know yet that there are only stations B and C in between. You ask the station attendant/person waiting/someone who knows:

How do I get to D from here?

The attendant replies:

Oh, just get on the train/bus/subway and go 3 stops.

the stops being B, C, and your goal D, and you don't count the stop you're at. Looking at the map, B is 1 stop, C is 2 stops, and D is 3 stops, you count from one starting with the next stop and you stop counting on the goal. "Go 3 stops." -> count to 3, the stop you're on at 3 is your goal.

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To be explicit, let's follow this all the way to your destination D.

So you've just got on the bus at A, and someone asks (the bus may have started up or maybe not left yet):

How far to D?

The correct and universally understood response that you make (because now you know) is:

3 stops.

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Now you're on the bus and it has stopped at B. Same question How far is D?:

2 more stops til D

(works also if the bus is between B and C)

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The bus is at C now. How many more stops?

1 more stop

If you're between C and D, its either

1 more stop.

or

The next stop is where we get off.

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You're coming up on D... what do you say to someone who doesn't know? All they know is that they're still between C and D. The answer is mostly the same.

This is our stop.

It's coming up now.

1 more stop.

The next stop.

So the principle is, don't count the stop you are currently at.

As an aside, 'normal' people count starting from 1. I make this explicit because some technically minded people start counting from 0, which is logically consistent only if you are considering the empty set. So you could say that you can count this stop if you also start counting at 0.

Answer 2

I think you've answered your own question!

I find two more stops, then ours quite unambiguous:
two more stops clearly does not include the current stop (if you're at a stop), but
it does include the next stop (if you are between stops).
(If you are just approaching a stop, I might say two more after this one, ....)
By saying then ours, I think the then clearly excludes all previously mentioned stops.

Or you could say something like We get off at the third stop (from here).
If you were just approaching a stop, I might amplify that to say We get off at the third stop after this one.

Answer 3

I like John Lawler's comment about counting fenceposts versus counting fence segments. I think the bus scenario might become less ambiguous if Alice and Bob count the segments between stops rather than the stops themselves. This way, there's no need to worry about whether the current stop is included, or about whether the destination is included. The only problem is, when the bus is halfway between stops, does the current segment count or not. This could be fixed by counting not the number of segments remaining, but the number of "complete segments" remaining.

So how about something like this?

Alice: Have we reached our stop yet, Bob?

Bob: No, Alice. Two more complete segments to go.

Alice: Thank you, Bob, that's most helpful of you. And thank you for being so unambiguous.